Infinite Loops "The Blog"

7/31/06

C++ General Gaming plus Chess

This post is from February 2005 can be found here. 

I have emailed the original poster informing him that I have archived his posts here.  I do not alter anyone's words or their spelling.  There is no difference to the post being visible in the forum to being viewed here in it's unedited true copy.  Any member that is not active in the forum receives an email to last known address informing them that I would like to re-post on the Blog. 

I chose this thread in the C++ folder even though it is not a particular programming question, it is general advice.  I have
seen this same type of question asked in every single programming forum I have ever gone to.  I felt the advice  00010100
received from Loop Members was the most realistic and not giving false hope.

Beginner Programmers are very eager to learn everything and want to make a name for themselves
and sometimes this eagerness is taken advantage of in the workplace.  



Original post by     
From:     00010100 - from here on referred to as Binary Boy

Hello all, I am an up and coming programmer hoping to get in the video game business and maybe eventually create a program

that will get me enough money to create my own little oriental village for my family and myself :). well im looking forward

to meeting all of you.

p.s
i don?t know if i did it right but can someone guess what number i have as my name :)


MDM Reloaded offers this very good idea.


>>video game business

The video game business is not exactly a good 'career'.
The local gaming company is famous for hiring junior programmers out of college, working them senseless with unpaid overtime,
throwing the occasional cheap gimmicky toy at them (which is worth far less than the cost of overtime) and then replacing the
overworked workers with a new batch of fresh college grads.

There's a lot more business doing industrial computing, such as writing applications which make doing business easier,
whether it's commercial (customer billing databases) or industrial (controllers for automated processes)
If you want to be cutting edge, write something that runs on the Symbian OS (the os built into a cell phone) which ties the
phone's built in voice recognition to the phone co's mappiing software (ie.. 'mapme' which uses radio towers to triangulate
position or GPS) so that you can say 'Phone.. which way to the Mann Chinese Theatre?" and the phone will be able to draw you a map. And sell that program to the Phone companies for ten bucks a pop.

Pim has guess his name - an excellent demonstration of binary conversion on the fly.

Sure, it's DC4.

Groetjes, Pim

//////////////


Binary Boy posts his next question and it is clear as to why he posted this in the C++ folder instead
of general programming questions folder, but thankfully the lovely hostess (moi) is not hung up on these kinds of things.


what languages do you guys recommend I learn in order to be successful? at the moment I am taking C++ in collage.

////////////


Bluestardrag---- this member goofed on the profile -- it suppose to be Bluestardragon-- Just thought I would point
that out-- it is in the Personal Quote of this members Profile.


The response here was very realistic,  honest and hopefully taken.  
/////////

Bluestar quotes a portion of binery boy's post.
"i don?t know if i did it right but can someone guess what number i have as my name :)"

let see hmmm 2 * 10 or ten thousand and 100 :)

As for being a game programmer thats, like trying to be come a rock star or more like a movie producer. It can be done but
take both luck and skill. And very likly you'll need big money backing you for your game to get to the market place. It's not
like it was in the early 80 when you can buy an Apple //e or an commdore, Go out buy a book on assembly and then start your
gaming company in a garage. You can still do but it's not easy. If you go the self employed route you should go for one of
the Dale Carnegie course and dealing with pepole. If fact go out and buy the book How to Win Friends & Influence pepole by
Dale Carnegie, What that book will give you, is more than any computer langauge can, No matter what choice you make. (in fact
I need to read it again ). 2 take a course in investing and money mangment and you'll be able to avoid 90% of the mistake
that pepole make.

Now for making games. Dont try to make the lattest highest graphic game, or the most cool game that you think of. Insted
start small like trying to create card games and text games. And try to make them fun. By starting small you will learn the
basic about game desine and charater creation. Now Im going to you something I learn by helping my father who manage arcade
game rooms when I was a kid. Pac-Man wich came out in 1980 would make more money than more advance machine with better
graphics as late as 1992. Why Pac-Man was simple and fun. The moral a good game is simple and fun. Not the latest graphics,
Not the fastest machine, but a game just needs to be fun. Oh and the last time I check in 2000, Pac-Man still brung in more
money than many of the more advance games in a arcade.

BlueStarDragon :)


Note the mention to Pacman and simple games--- see they are simple and fun and that is why I love my Namco edition for playstation2 with Galaga and Pacman and etc---  ok back to the reason for this post.  


Now it seems the thread has gone a bit OT but that is ok. 
MDM comes back this analogy about Chess, not sure why but it is a very profound observation.



That reminds me.. a friend of mine studied game theory, and he said that
chess is a bad game because it's purely skill, and the outcome can be determined after a few moves.
Good games have an element of luck and unknown outcome to them.

Ok the thread has been brought back On Topic by gwareth- Jason

The challenging part of Chess, which makes it a good game for programmers, is trying to do an AI. Creating a two-player chess
game is an exercise in monotony as it is simple (not counting graphics or the flashy stuff).

As for getting into the industry, there are a few things you need.

1. A 4-year degree in engineering or computer science
2. A desire to create games and the ability to show people you can do it
3. Drive. You have to want it and you have to be able to do whatever it takes to get what you want. Drive and ambition will
take you far in the industry.
4. The ability to communicate. Make sure your english is good (if you are programming in the states or Canada). Make sure you
can write clear, concise paragraphs and that you remember to grammar and spell-check your work.
5. Prove that you have the ability to learn whatever they throw at you. Overcoming obstacles.

And finally, you'll need luck and the ability to persevere through difficult times and rejections. A producer who used to
work for my company (and is now Executive Producer at NCSoft for AutoAssault), told a group of people at a conference this
past fall that he submitted resumes to companies for TWO years before he finally got a job. But he never gave up on it and
now he's making big bucks and his own games.

Best of luck to you. Perhaps one day if you make it into the industry we will work together.

- Jason


Bluestar has another comment re Chess.

Game theory should not be confuse with just playing games. Game theory tends be a system for studying things like politics
and social Patterns ( and more :)). It's not about making games, thoe you can use the info help I'm Sure. By the way chess is
a very good game look at how old it is. Plus a Russian Czar one time try beheading people to make them stop playing.

BlueStarDragon:)


A little late but better then never - Yankiwi comes along and could have won the 64 million dollar question.

>>can someone guess what number i have as my name :)

How about 20 (decimal)?

/////

00010100 joins back in the thread , I don't think he had an interest in the Chess.


YOU ARE CORRECT SIR :)
And I thank all of you for your advice

_________________________________________

However , he was thankful for the advice received and probably will never play Chess !
I have sent an email to this member and will post an update as to how this beginning programmer is doing.
Is he doing games? Maybe his work is on your Cellphone as Per MDM's advice.  Hopefully we will find out.

Well we had a reply from Binary Boy and here is an update:

Hello everyone,
Well yes you may use the post you asked me about. As far as what I am doing now . . . I am still in college and am taking Intro to Java this semester. Although I still love video games I have found myself intrigued by how operating systems and the innards of a PC work. What I would really like to do now is improve my programming so that I could help out the open source community (Linux distributions, Open Office, etc.). Well if any of you have any advice on this new path that I want to take let me know.

So there you have it.  No Chess but still on a good path to his goals. 
 

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